violent fantasizing - Wild Minds network2024-03-28T12:14:30Zhttps://wildminds.ning.com/forum/topics/violent-fantasizing-1?commentId=4661400%3AComment%3A363057&xg_source=msg_com_forum&feed=yes&xn_auth=noThank you for sharing, Daniel…tag:wildminds.ning.com,2020-11-16:4661400:Comment:3667712020-11-16T19:59:59.228ZAmandahttps://wildminds.ning.com/profile/Amanda396
<p>Thank you for sharing, Daniel. This is an interesting discussion. You are not alone. My personal reaction to what you describe is -- No need to feel bad! Or ashamed or embarrassed! If you need to replay an experience over and over, there's nothing wrong with that. I do relate to the desperate desire to get out of that loop though. What has been most effective for me personally has been to say, okay, if my body spirit needs to do this over and over, there's a good reason. I'm trying to get…</p>
<p>Thank you for sharing, Daniel. This is an interesting discussion. You are not alone. My personal reaction to what you describe is -- No need to feel bad! Or ashamed or embarrassed! If you need to replay an experience over and over, there's nothing wrong with that. I do relate to the desperate desire to get out of that loop though. What has been most effective for me personally has been to say, okay, if my body spirit needs to do this over and over, there's a good reason. I'm trying to get something I need, but I'm not getting it. So I try to identify what I need, and get that for myself. And that can happen in the daydream and it can happen in this world or both! I used to really struggle to stay out of violent daydreams. But I actually do use my daydreaming powers to heal trauma effectively. I saw someone post that it's an ineffective way to deal with trauma, but I've found the opposite to be true. I'm a witch, and I do time travel rituals to go back into specific traumatic memories to sit with myself, to protect myself, to nurture and care for myself in those moments. Or even change the outcomes. I have, and still do, struggle with welding my daydreaming power - sometimes it's unwieldy. But when I can harness it, which I feel largely effect at now, it's the most powerful tool I have at my disposal for healing and for growth. And not just for revisiting traumatic memories, but for healing traumas I can't name that live in my body or persistent traumas that aren't located in a specific event. And also for creating joy and pleasure for myself which are essential for healing trauma. I also find daydreaming to be an effective way for me to explore who I am becoming and what kind of life I want to create. There's a reflexiveness between the other worlds I visit and this one - they change each other. There is certainly some escapism, but sometimes that's needed and essential. I find my daydreaming functions on many levels. I'm only just now learning that other people have this same capacity. And I'm reeling with the diversity of how everyone has learned to/is learning to move through the world with it. At some point, I just decided to stop fighting it. Like if you can't beat it join it kind of a thing. But I also always had a sneaky suspicion that there was something important about it. So I just leaned in. And I daydreamed with complete abandon, and I would call in sick to stay home and daydream A LOT -- that absolutely had a negative impact on my work life, but I'm convinced it was the best and healthiest thing I could have done. I almost got fired from that job. Then I got a new job, and I DID get fired from that job. But for the past five years, I've been very fortunate to have a job with a lot of flexibility and for the past year I have been working remotely full time. Which gives me a lot more freedom to lean into the daydreams. Also, many years ago, I developed a motto: "triage for shame." So, over time I learned to daydream more completely and enthusiastically and whole heartedly and without any shame about it at all (regardless of the content), and it does require jumping through some practical hoops to keep my job and life together / it also requires just not caring about how clean my house is sometimes and things like that. But what I've found is that my capacity for world building is one of my greatest strengths - it's become my greatest sources of healing and growth as well. There are endless worlds inside myself. How magical and beautiful is that? Some of them are bleak and violent, but for me, the releasing of shame has allowed me a lot more agency in how I visit and exit all the worlds. I also really like the advice to shift some of that energy back into THIS world. That's a built in part of all my rituals - give back/pay it forward. That's always a really effective way of creating a positive feedback loop between this world and all the other worlds too, so that, for me at least, they start to harmonize in a way instead of always feeling like I'm being pulled apart in different directions, I feel like an artist or like I'm part of a choir of worlds. </p> This evening,as I was doing s…tag:wildminds.ning.com,2020-11-11:4661400:Comment:3635852020-11-11T05:37:26.710ZDaniel C Cunninghamhttps://wildminds.ning.com/profile/DanielCCunningham
<p>This evening,as I was doing some business stuff online I fell into the "revenge fantasies" - as Melanie termed it - behavior when I thought ahead to talking to a bank officer. There I am, typing away an email to a businessperson about making a business deal. It is as simple as can be: I am a Vietnam veteran, old, single, with a disability income from the VA and I want to buy a house. So, the realtors have been bothering me with phone calls and text messages and they want to manipulate me and…</p>
<p>This evening,as I was doing some business stuff online I fell into the "revenge fantasies" - as Melanie termed it - behavior when I thought ahead to talking to a bank officer. There I am, typing away an email to a businessperson about making a business deal. It is as simple as can be: I am a Vietnam veteran, old, single, with a disability income from the VA and I want to buy a house. So, the realtors have been bothering me with phone calls and text messages and they want to manipulate me and make me dance to their tunes. They want to degrade me because I don't know finances and they believe the measure of a human being's worth is in her credit score. And I believe people who think that way have sold their souls to the devil. </p>
<p>My Uncle Sam does VA loans to people like me. I know that I do not have many years left to live and that it does not matter that I will die before I can re-pay the loan - because the bank or the government will take back the property anyway when I check out. And the mortgage payments will be less than what is costs to rent a place in the meantime.</p>
<p>But I will have to go through talking to bank officers and I foresee them humiliating me - talking down to me like I am retarded, degrading me for not knowing this stuff, asking stupid, impertinent, personal questions ... and I respond by saying "That is none of your d**n business..... I am not going to answer that.... the U.S. government is guaranteeing this so what is your problem??...." Then I am acting out yelling at the antagonist, pointing my finger at him, though I know it is rude and offensive. And he has to try to dominate me and I won't back down and I threaten to kick his a**, people in the bank are shocked and are thinking of calling the police....</p>
<p>Then I calm down and worry that someone in my friend's house has heard me. My friend has busted me before; driving her car; she has asked me why I am shaking my head or what I am mumbling about. She knows about my MaDD and she accepts that it is just the way I am and this sh*t is not pathological.</p>
<p>It is disappointing that after a couple days of being relatively present and coming back to reality regularly by focusing on breathing, I fell into this violent fantasizing - triggered by something good that I was looking forward to. It is like I have been screwed so much in the past, humiliated all my life and deep down I believe they are going to find some excuse to cheat me out of this thing too. </p>
<p>I am trying to follow my Buddhist practices to be detached and let go of ego and not project negative thinking. I did not do very well this time. </p>
<p> <br/> <br/> <cite>Jenn Taylor said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="https://wildminds.ning.com/forum/topics/violent-fantasizing-1?commentId=4661400%3AComment%3A363057&xg_source=msg_com_forum#4661400Comment362992"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>I'm in therapy 4 PTSD, Dialectic Behavior Therapy, dealing with anger and my violent tendencies. I'm learning (in person b4 Covid, by Zoom now) that not all personal encounters r abusive. I'm learning 2 assess whether an encounter is physically/emotionally/mentally dangerous or not, finding that most are not immediately dangerous. The more non-threatening people I encounter, the more progress I make. My weekly therapist teaches me normal-people reactions 2 my situations. The more my conflicts, the more I'm learning 2 respond calmly, 2 take the time 2 gather facts & respond reasonably. People still scare me, family and strangers, but I'm learning 2 stand tall and appear unafraid.</p>
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</blockquote> I'm in therapy 4 PTSD, Dialec…tag:wildminds.ning.com,2020-11-09:4661400:Comment:3629922020-11-09T23:54:32.008ZJenn Taylorhttps://wildminds.ning.com/profile/JennTaylor
<p>I'm in therapy 4 PTSD, Dialectic Behavior Therapy, dealing with anger and my violent tendencies. I'm learning (in person b4 Covid, by Zoom now) that not all personal encounters r abusive. I'm learning 2 assess whether an encounter is physically/emotionally/mentally dangerous or not, finding that most are not immediately dangerous. The more non-threatening people I encounter, the more progress I make. My weekly therapist teaches me normal-people reactions 2 my situations. The more my…</p>
<p>I'm in therapy 4 PTSD, Dialectic Behavior Therapy, dealing with anger and my violent tendencies. I'm learning (in person b4 Covid, by Zoom now) that not all personal encounters r abusive. I'm learning 2 assess whether an encounter is physically/emotionally/mentally dangerous or not, finding that most are not immediately dangerous. The more non-threatening people I encounter, the more progress I make. My weekly therapist teaches me normal-people reactions 2 my situations. The more my conflicts, the more I'm learning 2 respond calmly, 2 take the time 2 gather facts & respond reasonably. People still scare me, family and strangers, but I'm learning 2 stand tall and appear unafraid.</p> Yes, I agree that finding the…tag:wildminds.ning.com,2020-11-09:4661400:Comment:3631332020-11-09T20:08:43.478ZDaniel C Cunninghamhttps://wildminds.ning.com/profile/DanielCCunningham
<p>Yes, I agree that finding the right words to say at the right time is the right way to go. </p>
<p>And now, as adults, it seems the best we can do is to be calm under stress and maybe allow the right response to come, make a mature decision to hit back at the offender or decide then in the moment to drop it because it really was not worth it - but not chicken out - and then respond properly. And then accept the consequences of our action or non-action. And not add it to the load of…</p>
<p>Yes, I agree that finding the right words to say at the right time is the right way to go. </p>
<p>And now, as adults, it seems the best we can do is to be calm under stress and maybe allow the right response to come, make a mature decision to hit back at the offender or decide then in the moment to drop it because it really was not worth it - but not chicken out - and then respond properly. And then accept the consequences of our action or non-action. And not add it to the load of resentments that we are carrying.</p>
<p>Sort of like learning to walk when we are adults. </p>
<p>I wish you luck to. I hope we can give each other support.<br/> <cite>Blanca Margatroid said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="https://wildminds.ning.com/forum/topics/violent-fantasizing-1?commentId=4661400%3AComment%3A363057&xg_source=msg_com_forum#4661400Comment363057"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>I can relate. Sometimes I also imagine myself punching one of the bullies I met in high school, or a really stupid and mean coworker. Normally my daydreams are not like that, but it happens from time to time. I also recreate past conversations when I didn't say what I wanted to say. All I can hope is that someday I find the words right there in the right moment when I need to say them.</p>
<p>I wish you the best! It isn't always easy to cope with the past, but I'm sure you will find your way :)</p>
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</blockquote> I can relate. Sometimes I als…tag:wildminds.ning.com,2020-11-09:4661400:Comment:3630572020-11-09T18:52:35.253ZBlanca Margatroidhttps://wildminds.ning.com/profile/BlancaMargatroid
<p>I can relate. Sometimes I also imagine myself punching one of the bullies I met in high school, or a really stupid and mean coworker. Normally my daydreams are not like that, but it happens from time to time. I also recreate past conversations when I didn't say what I wanted to say. All I can hope is that someday I find the words right there in the right moment when I need to say them.</p>
<p>I wish you the best! It isn't always easy to cope with the past, but I'm sure you will find your way…</p>
<p>I can relate. Sometimes I also imagine myself punching one of the bullies I met in high school, or a really stupid and mean coworker. Normally my daydreams are not like that, but it happens from time to time. I also recreate past conversations when I didn't say what I wanted to say. All I can hope is that someday I find the words right there in the right moment when I need to say them.</p>
<p>I wish you the best! It isn't always easy to cope with the past, but I'm sure you will find your way :)</p> Daniel,
You're absolutely rig…tag:wildminds.ning.com,2020-11-09:4661400:Comment:3628652020-11-09T17:16:58.567ZMelaniehttps://wildminds.ning.com/profile/Azrael
<p>Daniel,</p>
<p>You're absolutely right. I should have clarified: MD is a very <span style="text-decoration: underline;">ineffective</span> way to deal with trauma or any other circumstances in life. I certainly believed at one point that MD was helping me process and cope with negative situations, but ultimately MD made my circumstances and quality of life much worse. I agree, it would have been much healthier to live with our experiences, feel our feelings, and accept the disappointments of…</p>
<p>Daniel,</p>
<p>You're absolutely right. I should have clarified: MD is a very <span style="text-decoration: underline;">ineffective</span> way to deal with trauma or any other circumstances in life. I certainly believed at one point that MD was helping me process and cope with negative situations, but ultimately MD made my circumstances and quality of life much worse. I agree, it would have been much healthier to live with our experiences, feel our feelings, and accept the disappointments of reality we cannot change. I know I'd be a more well-adjusted adult if I had. </p>
<p>As for the physical sensations your MD causes, I understand what you're going through. My daydreams often raise my blood pressure, fill me with tension, upset my stomach, send me into rages, and sometimes give me full blown panic attacks. It would be so much better if we could stop this behavior. </p> Melanie,
Thank you sharing th…tag:wildminds.ning.com,2020-11-09:4661400:Comment:3630522020-11-09T17:05:03.487ZDaniel C Cunninghamhttps://wildminds.ning.com/profile/DanielCCunningham
<p>Melanie,</p>
<p>Thank you sharing this. It is almost impossible for me to believe there are other people who go through this "revenge fantasies" thing.</p>
<p>But as a way of processing trauma I cannot accept that. I do not feel that this has helped me to process the past. It is more like regurgitating and re-eating something that is sickening. It is certainly bad for my health in some ways: it gets my heart racing and blood pressure way up; upsets my stomach sometimes; it leads me (rarely)…</p>
<p>Melanie,</p>
<p>Thank you sharing this. It is almost impossible for me to believe there are other people who go through this "revenge fantasies" thing.</p>
<p>But as a way of processing trauma I cannot accept that. I do not feel that this has helped me to process the past. It is more like regurgitating and re-eating something that is sickening. It is certainly bad for my health in some ways: it gets my heart racing and blood pressure way up; upsets my stomach sometimes; it leads me (rarely) to hurt myself by slamming my fist at something or throwing something and breaking it; if I get busted - if someone hears me talking, swearing or acting out the motions of fighting someone or sees it on my face - then I am mortified. Then I wish I was dead.</p>
<p>I would much rather - if I could - stop this behavior completely and focus on the present and let go and accept the hurt and injustice. </p>
<p>That would allow me to look forward possibly to better things happening and possibly to have more control over what happens in my real life.</p>
<p>I believe it would be better to live with the anxieties of everyday disappointments and go on than to escape into MaDD, sort of like addicts go to their drugs and alcohol. </p>
<p>I have read in some of my psychological books that some people cut themselves and I think my revenge fantasies are little better than that for helping to escape from a bad situation and the memories of bad events and afterwards you have to deal with the results.</p>
<p>I think to just live with the experience, even though it is so depressing, would be better. </p> Daniel,
You're definitely not…tag:wildminds.ning.com,2020-11-09:4661400:Comment:3630482020-11-09T15:53:41.432ZMelaniehttps://wildminds.ning.com/profile/Azrael
<p>Daniel,</p>
<p>You're definitely not alone in this. I am plagued by daydreams in which I am either a perpetrator or a victim of violent abuse. Revenge fantasies are some of my most intrusive as well. They disturb me greatly, and I wonder if I am a bad person, but I've learned that a lot of MDers have similar fantasies and that they're our way of processing trauma and gaining a sense of control over our experiences. </p>
<p>Daniel,</p>
<p>You're definitely not alone in this. I am plagued by daydreams in which I am either a perpetrator or a victim of violent abuse. Revenge fantasies are some of my most intrusive as well. They disturb me greatly, and I wonder if I am a bad person, but I've learned that a lot of MDers have similar fantasies and that they're our way of processing trauma and gaining a sense of control over our experiences. </p> It seems as if this is your w…tag:wildminds.ning.com,2020-11-08:4661400:Comment:3628532020-11-08T22:49:22.684ZTheaxehttps://wildminds.ning.com/profile/Theaxe
<p>It seems as if this is your way of coping or taking control of something you had loss of control over.</p>
<p>In my past, my father and brother were the first people to make me go hide into my maladaptive daydreaming. Today, as an adult, they <em>never</em> appear in one single daydream. I have removed them from my life and only allow people I truly want to see in my daydreams instead. <em>I</em> have control over <em>that</em>. I didn't have control of it growing up.</p>
<p>Sometimes people…</p>
<p>It seems as if this is your way of coping or taking control of something you had loss of control over.</p>
<p>In my past, my father and brother were the first people to make me go hide into my maladaptive daydreaming. Today, as an adult, they <em>never</em> appear in one single daydream. I have removed them from my life and only allow people I truly want to see in my daydreams instead. <em>I</em> have control over <em>that</em>. I didn't have control of it growing up.</p>
<p>Sometimes people tend to do the opposite of something to control what they once couldn't. For example, if a man never wanted his wife to cut her hair throughout their marriage, but then they split up - she may cut her hair to free herself of that control. </p>
<p>We use our daydreams as a form of coping and soothing during the times we struggle with our lack of control in real life.</p>
<p>I really don't think you're alone on this one. Many people daydream unpleasant things to find resolution within something they can control. If you come to realize it, perhaps that is the first step in managing your feelings about moving forward. Good luck! :)</p> Thank you for sharing, Jenn,…tag:wildminds.ning.com,2020-11-06:4661400:Comment:3623752020-11-06T15:22:43.527ZDaniel C Cunninghamhttps://wildminds.ning.com/profile/DanielCCunningham
<p>Thank you for sharing, Jenn,</p>
<p></p>
<p>I am surprised to learn than someone else is going through what I have.</p>
<p>At the same time I am sorry you suffered through this. You got mis-diagnosed, as I did, but it seems like you are in a safe place now. I have a ways to go.</p>
<p>The only source I have for help for my mental and physical conditions has been the VA and they have done a lot of harm to me along with the good. </p>
<p>Funny when I think that - when I was your age - 7 years…</p>
<p>Thank you for sharing, Jenn,</p>
<p></p>
<p>I am surprised to learn than someone else is going through what I have.</p>
<p>At the same time I am sorry you suffered through this. You got mis-diagnosed, as I did, but it seems like you are in a safe place now. I have a ways to go.</p>
<p>The only source I have for help for my mental and physical conditions has been the VA and they have done a lot of harm to me along with the good. </p>
<p>Funny when I think that - when I was your age - 7 years ago, living in Thailand, life was so much simpler and more enjoyable. And then a couple years ago it seemed the Rage became so much stronger a factor in my life, and in my MaDD. And I got shocked with the realization I am old. </p>
<p>Now I am in another new location, with another VA hospital and maybe this time they will take the time to look at me and do the best they can for me.</p>
<p>It is hard to accept that as I stay more in the present, less in fantasy, I get to experience anxiety and confusion, delays, disrespect, people in all their weirdness; the things that people normally learned to deal with in childhood. But I had no right to think that it would be a rose garden here in the real world.</p>
<p>To think that is just a dream. </p>
<p>I wish you luck and I hope we can keep in touch.<br/> <br/> <cite>Jenn Taylor said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="https://wildminds.ning.com/forum/topics/violent-fantasizing-1?commentId=4661400%3AComment%3A362644&xg_source=msg_com_forum#4661400Comment362644"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>As a child & teen I was abused by my parents every which way. I'm 66 now. I've experienced violent rages most of my life. Mainly against innocent people, just people who happened 2 trigger me. 2 years ago I realized I needed help. Or else I was going to do something that would land me in jail/prison. I'd been diagnosed as bi-polar 15 years before & prescribed meds. But they were the wrong meds. Yes they curbed my rages but caused me 2 sleep 12-18 hours a day. Fortunately my Disability kicked in, so I didn't have to work a 9-5. & had a steady income. But, all of a sudden 2 years ago my rage returned. At a targeted person I felt deserved 2 be removed from this earth. Fortunately my brain told me physical revenge was NOT in my best interest & I sought professional help. I found a local walkin mental clinic, free 2 me & able 2 help me immediately. My psychiatrist re-diagnosed me. Not as bi-polar but as PTSD. & prescribed new medication. I was also offered counseling which I accepted. All services were in person until Covid. Now my sessions are by phone or Zoom. I'm grateful 2 finally be correctly diagnosed, medicated properly and receive therapy from counselors who have also experienced rough lives. I was lucky 2 connect with these mental health services before Covid. I live in a safe home, which helps alot. & I'm learning 2 assess situations & control my emotions, which leads 2 a more relaxed ME & higher self-esteem.</p>
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